New to the MTS - What are the C3 Values in the KH-2 & KH

[warhedf1]

First off, let me say a BIG first time hello to everyone here!

I have a simple question, and then I have a long-ish post!

Question: What are the stock values of the C3 Capacitor in the KH-2 and KH-3 modules?

Now for the situation!

I am in the middle of trying out a RM100-KH and, so far it's getting dangerously close to what I want to hear as far as my general tone voicing likes are concerned. Funnily enough, I seem to have better luck getting tight tones out of the KH-3 mod than the KH-2 mod. My guess is that because of the extra gain/compression, it effectively thins out some frequencies on the bottom end that I don't like.

Now, having said all that, it should be pointed out that I tune to low B standard and I have EMG's in everything. I get killer sounds out of my Boogie Mark II c+, and I get some ok tones out of my Road King but what I'd like to know is whether changing the C3 capacitor in the KH-2 and KH-3 to a .0001 would get the pick attack and extra bottom end tightness happening for me.

The power section of the KH seems to be plenty responsive, I just need more definition and tightness without adding a parametric eq or something of that nature to the signal chain.

The KH-2 and KH-3 mods are good in general, it's just that when you try to bring the bottom end up a little, the bass knob introduces frequencies that I really DO want AND, some thuddy/sub-ish frequencies that I don't want.

Thoughts anyone?
warhedf1

P.S. I have a wide variety of cabinets to play around with, and I'm getting roughly the same result out of all my cabs.

 

[JKD]

From memory..I think the stock c3 in my KH3 is 22pf...but I didn't pay much attention because it sounds so great.

Did you consider changing the power tubes?

I hate to say this but overall the Randall MTS stuff isn't uber tight...once you've gone to 1pf in c3 I think you've basically gone as far as you can without making the whole thing sound like it's missing something.

The MTS amps are quite bass heavy/dark (to me) and the KH head has more bass (a change in value in the power amp mean the density control adds more thump than an RM100) so I think it's technically slightly looser....am not an amp expert by any means.

For reference, I almost never have my Density control set past 9 o'clock and the Bass control on my modules at a maximum of 12 o'clock...sometimes 1 if I'm looking for something extra on lead(ish) playing in the upper register...but I prefer to play off my gain and bass controls to get the 'juice' I'm looking for...gain goes up, bass comes down a little.

Another option is to look to Pete for clarity mod on the module?

 

[warhedf1]

Thanks for the quick reply bro!

You know, I had thought about popping a set of EL-34's or E-34-L's in there and taking it for a spin. That very well could be the way forward unto itself. Funny that you also suggested that I try shooting Pete (okstrat) an email because I just did! Seems that Pete knows how to cross the t's and dot the I's with these modules. Everything I've read on this board about his work is great. The thing about the KH-3 mod is that it's SO close to what I've been looking for that it's crazy! I'm just trying to get that last bit of clarity and detail happening with out adding an artificial external source i.e. a parametric eq or something of that sort.


Ok, I'm gonna round up some tubes from the 34 family!

Thanks!
warhedf1

 

[JKD]

EL34 / E34L can be a bit of a love hate relationship with some....it's a different character than the 6L6 for sure.

I don't remember what the KH head comes with but you should possibly also consider a 5881WXT...still a 6L6 type but a different flavor. Egnater ships with these by default and I've been running them in place of JJ 6L6s in my RM50HB for a while...a little bit less in the bass dept and overall just a nicer sounding tube.

I've tried a lot of tubes.

KT77s....loved them at first, more bottom than a EL34 but still retain agressive mid character and more 6L6 like high end...but in the end I want back to the 6L6

KT88s..huge sounding tube but not what I'd go for if you're thinking the bass is a little too much already.

E34Ls....I think I prefer this to an EL34 but the couple of pairs I've had in my MTS didn't feel very 'lively' if that makes any sense.

Another thought to consider...is maybe change your phase inverter...this might sound like voodoo but if you change the way the pre is driving the power tubes, it changes the feel of the amp to me....

 

[warhedf1]

I'm defintely listening to you when it comes to your experiences with the various power tubes you mentioned. I think that between experimenting with different power tubes, and maybe a couple of cap changes in the mods, I should be able to nail it down.

Out of extreme curiousity, what does changing the phase inverter entail? I'm pretty handy with a soldering iron on a pc board so, it wouldn't be too nutty for me to change a component or two. What will a phase inverter change bring about in the grand scheme of things? I'm up for it if it'll help me take another step in refining my sound.

Thanks again!
warhedf1

 

[JKD]

I'm defintely listening to you when it comes to your experiences with the various power tubes you mentioned. I think that between experimenting with different power tubes, and maybe a couple of cap changes in the mods, I should be able to nail it down.

Out of extreme curiousity, what does changing the phase inverter entail? I'm pretty handy with a soldering iron on a pc board so, it wouldn't be too nutty for me to change a component or two. What will a phase inverter change bring about in the grand scheme of things? I'm up for it if it'll help me take another step in refining my sound.

Thanks again!
warhedf1

I'm a terrible player but I spend a lot of time f'king around with my amp....

Phase Inverter is a simple tube change...the pre-amp closest to the power tubes.

I switched the EH in mine to either a Sovtek LPS, a New-Sensor Mullard re-issue 12ax7 or a GT 12ax7m...a long plate tube anyway. Tubes with different gain structures and output will change the interaction between the pre and power quite a lot...you can even switch to a 12at7.

 

[gtr31]

I know that VHT runs an AT7 in the PI and they are the Epitome of Tight, and clarity .I saw some schematic somewhere that I though Egnater runs AT7's in the PI stage as well .although I could be wrong

 

[JKD]

I know that VHT runs an AT7 in the PI and they are the Epitome of Tight, and clarity .I saw some schematic somewhere that I though Egnater runs AT7's in the PI stage as well .although I could be wrong

I have an M4 but I think the AT7 is in v1...never sure of the tube layout.

I've not checked my MOD50 but think it's an ax7 in the PI

I asked on Egnater forums about this...said they used to use an AT7 but generally use an AX7 now

 

[RD/Steve]

let's not forget about speakers and their impact on low end tightness.

the new kirk 4x12 with the celestion 100 just slays the bottom end. i suggest trying the head out with the appropriate 4x12's to get the full "intended" effect.