Looking to run one of the above through a tube power amp. If you have owned more than one of the units above and have run it as a preamp, comment on why you have the one you have and how it sounds in the mix of a band. I plan on using a separate eq at the same time also.
Line 6 hd500 vs GSP1101 vs Tech21 PSA 1.1 vs Digi rp500
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Wookieslayer
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I haven't tried any of these preamps but I used to own a Pod X3 live that I used to run to the return of my amps sometimes.
For strict ease of use I'd probably buy the HD500. Not only is it the newest modeler out of those but it has all the M class effects from Line 6 which I hear only good things about. The only downside I see in these units for guitar right now is the lack of user loadable cabinet impulse responses, but that would be only a factor when recording with the unit or going direct to the house PA when playing gigs.
Seeing as the HD500 is the newest, it's going to be updated the most in the future, possibly with new amp models or features. Also later down the line it will probably hold its value the best as Line 6 is pretty popular among the casual and pro crowd. With any of those other units you'll have to buy a MIDI or footboard controller and the HD board is all in one all ready to go! Might be cheaper to nab the HD500 when you consider this aspect; also since the other units are older they're going to depreciate in value sooner.
If I had to rate in order of which I would choose first with a power amp / cab rig it would probably be
HD500 > GSP > Tech21 > Digi like you posted. Possibly Tech21 before GSP (supposedly analog, sounds great) but then you'd have to buy another piece for effects.
If I didn't have enough amp heads already :roll: , or the Line 6 HD series could load user IR cabs, I'd have bought one a year ago. I'm still considering one for a future rig but there are other things coming out that have caught my eye... namely the DAR tube preamp with a built in cabinet impulse loader! 8) Not to mention all the nice small amp heads on their way!
Just my 2 cents on the subject... maybe four :lol:
Good luck,
Peter
For strict ease of use I'd probably buy the HD500. Not only is it the newest modeler out of those but it has all the M class effects from Line 6 which I hear only good things about. The only downside I see in these units for guitar right now is the lack of user loadable cabinet impulse responses, but that would be only a factor when recording with the unit or going direct to the house PA when playing gigs.
Seeing as the HD500 is the newest, it's going to be updated the most in the future, possibly with new amp models or features. Also later down the line it will probably hold its value the best as Line 6 is pretty popular among the casual and pro crowd. With any of those other units you'll have to buy a MIDI or footboard controller and the HD board is all in one all ready to go! Might be cheaper to nab the HD500 when you consider this aspect; also since the other units are older they're going to depreciate in value sooner.
If I had to rate in order of which I would choose first with a power amp / cab rig it would probably be
HD500 > GSP > Tech21 > Digi like you posted. Possibly Tech21 before GSP (supposedly analog, sounds great) but then you'd have to buy another piece for effects.
If I didn't have enough amp heads already :roll: , or the Line 6 HD series could load user IR cabs, I'd have bought one a year ago. I'm still considering one for a future rig but there are other things coming out that have caught my eye... namely the DAR tube preamp with a built in cabinet impulse loader! 8) Not to mention all the nice small amp heads on their way!
Just my 2 cents on the subject... maybe four :lol:
Good luck,
Peter
Julia
Well-known member
The HD, especially with the latest firmware update -- don't forget to do this because it's a massive improvement over the older firmware -- is better than the GSP1101, and any of the others listed. It's easy to use. I use mine all the time through my near field monitors. I don't need the volume levels anymore. For the gigging musician, you can go either with a tube power amp or a pair of QSC K10s. The QSC K10s is what many are doing with this and the AXE, or you could use the Atomic Powered monitor from Fractal -- I think it's about the same price as the K10.
Thanks for the replies, right now I just have an old rp80 into the return on my rm50 and it sounds ok. I'm thinking about selling my modules and getting an hd500 because after playing through the few tube amps I have owned, I always seemed to come back to my old solid state combo and the modeler. Now that I have been using the rm50 as the power amp I feel I am in the ball park as far as the tone I have been trying to get. At least for the time being. Must be all that Pantera I listen to.
Julia
Well-known member
It's just about suitability of your gear for your purpose. Nothing wrong with SS or tubes.
HughJasol
Well-known member
For what it's worth, I know that before they went to the AxeFX, Megadeth used the GSP1101. To what extent I don't know for sure, but I believe they were using the modeling as well as the effects . . .
Check with mojo possibly. He could give you some more info on the GSP1101. From the sounds of it that thing is killer. I'm kind of wondering if the bypass is programmable/assignable or how that would work. The more I think about it, with the 4CM method, the more I like what I hear.
ctgblue
Well-known member
Never played the HD500, but Tried the GSP, POD X3, Boss gt-10, etc.. and bought the Digitech RP-1000.
BUT, I liked it because I could "turn OFF" the modeling altogether and bypass everything but the effects.
The models were tons better than the Line 6 POD X3, which I sold to buy the Digitech (I never found the "right tone" out of the POD). Plus, the RP-1000 has a 'stomp box loop' which is like an effects loop on the board, which was pretty cool.
The only reason I got rid of the digitech was that I got better amps that had enough gain for me and was only using the crybaby and the modulation effects, so I dropped back to the GNX, which I had before the POD.
I always drop back to a high gain amp and dump the models though.
BUT, I liked it because I could "turn OFF" the modeling altogether and bypass everything but the effects.
The models were tons better than the Line 6 POD X3, which I sold to buy the Digitech (I never found the "right tone" out of the POD). Plus, the RP-1000 has a 'stomp box loop' which is like an effects loop on the board, which was pretty cool.
The only reason I got rid of the digitech was that I got better amps that had enough gain for me and was only using the crybaby and the modulation effects, so I dropped back to the GNX, which I had before the POD.
I always drop back to a high gain amp and dump the models though.
I bought the Line6 HD500 last week and already returned it. Another one of those 'buy it based on all the great reviews without trying it first because I'm in a hurry' things. It may be the greatest thing since sliced bread for everyone else, but I rate it a strong both thumbs down and a long slobbery raspberry. I couldn't get anything even slightly resembling a good sound out of the thing. I downloaded all the updates, installed all the software, tweaked the presets, downloaded every patch I could find, tweaked those too, started from scratch, finally got pissed and packed it back up and made the 5 hour round-trip drive back to the store. If I can't get a good sound out of something after trying for 5 days, then I simply don't want it. This sounds as dumb in my head as it will read in type but it's completely true... I would absolutely take my Digitech RP80 over a Line6 HD500 every single time without giving it a second thought.
disk11
Well-known member
That seems strange, what did you use to monitor the sound?
RM100 - both front end of Clean module and FX loops. I can get a very respectable sound either way with the Digitech RP80. Line6 HD500 sounded terrible both ways.
Various push/pull homebrew power amps (ECL86, 6V6, EL34, 6L6). Very hard to get anything but good sound through any of them. Cheap pedals, straight guitar, cell phone, computer, basically almost anything that creates or reproduces sound will kick butt through these. Line6 HD500 sounded terrible.
Various 'cheapy' amps. Not really fair to expect anything to make them sound good. Line6 HD500 sounded terrible.
Maybe I had a defective unit. Maybe I didn't know how to use it properly. All I know for sure is that it sounded best to me when it was turned off.
Various push/pull homebrew power amps (ECL86, 6V6, EL34, 6L6). Very hard to get anything but good sound through any of them. Cheap pedals, straight guitar, cell phone, computer, basically almost anything that creates or reproduces sound will kick butt through these. Line6 HD500 sounded terrible.
Various 'cheapy' amps. Not really fair to expect anything to make them sound good. Line6 HD500 sounded terrible.
Maybe I had a defective unit. Maybe I didn't know how to use it properly. All I know for sure is that it sounded best to me when it was turned off.
Julia
Well-known member
When you use the tube power section of a guitar amp, you only use the pre-amp model on the POD, not the full amp model, otherwise you will have phasing issues.
You also have to make sure you have the cabinet set to NO CABINET, otherwise you're modeling a guitar cabinet and playing through a guitar cabinet. This also will cause phasing issues.
Running the preamp or amp through another preamp won't work well either.
The factory presets all use cabinet models and full amp models. They are starting points.
I use mine FRFR out my near field monitors at home. I get very good tones with the unit, and it records very well. I've even gotten a close to Dumble tone.
A lot of people like the Mesa model, but I hate it, and I hate the Mesa cab. I've come to the conclusion I don't like Mesas even when I've heard them live.
You also have to make sure you have the cabinet set to NO CABINET, otherwise you're modeling a guitar cabinet and playing through a guitar cabinet. This also will cause phasing issues.
Running the preamp or amp through another preamp won't work well either.
The factory presets all use cabinet models and full amp models. They are starting points.
I use mine FRFR out my near field monitors at home. I get very good tones with the unit, and it records very well. I've even gotten a close to Dumble tone.
A lot of people like the Mesa model, but I hate it, and I hate the Mesa cab. I've come to the conclusion I don't like Mesas even when I've heard them live.
ctgblue
Well-known member
Your experience is the same as what I had with the POD X3.Paradox said:
I used and Atomic Reactor which is designed for these, and never could get a "right tone" from the POD either.
The digitech RP-1000 sounded great right away, as did the GNX3 I had sold to get the POD.
Now the line 6 effects were pretty good, but the models were not.
It's too bad Johnson could not keep up with Line 6's innovations and support, they had much better sound.
I actually though about trying to grab an RM4 and use it through one of those Atomic amps too., but I prefer a real head or combo
Big Daddy
Well-known member
I have to admit I am biased here, I don't like Line-6 anything. It just never ever sounds real to me. EVER! I had a buddy with the latest, greatest POD dealio, which one I am not positive, but it was new and improved... He SWORE to me that it sounded much better than any of the Line-6 stuff we had tried in the past - which, in fairness it did - and tha he was getting tones similar to mine on tape and in the room.
Of course, I was skeptical, but he's no idiot, so I gave him the benefit of the doubt and invited hime to my studio for sound comparisons and Jack Daniels.
I must begrudginly admit his Line-6 stuff sounded way better than my old POD I have laying around. Then again, it had so far to come, ya know?
Anyway, under close scrutiny, it still had that POD sound. Mids are passable, Lows are fake sounding and the Highs are scratchy and inorganic. Don't get me wrong, they have made strides, but they still have a ways to go.
So I turn off my Egnater Rig and hook up my GSP-1101 and show him the dirfferences I hear. He reluctantly admits that the 1101 sounds great, but he doesn't seem to fully grasp the points I am trying to make. In the end he agrees my 1101 is at least as good as his stuff - even though it BLOWS his stuff away - and I agree that the new Line-6 stuff sound way better that the old stuff - hardly any admission on my part :wink:
A couple of months go by and I go see his band play a bar near my house. His tone sound really good. I'm thinking maybe I was too harsh. Maybe this stuff does sound good through a PA. Maybe he isn't off his rocker
So I go up, after his set and what do I see? That's right, DIGITECH stuff in his rack!!!
He went and played with a used one at a Musicgoround and traded his Line-6 rig for it.
I KNEW I was right :lol:
That's my story and I am sticking to it! LOL
Your mileage my vary
H
Of course, I was skeptical, but he's no idiot, so I gave him the benefit of the doubt and invited hime to my studio for sound comparisons and Jack Daniels.
I must begrudginly admit his Line-6 stuff sounded way better than my old POD I have laying around. Then again, it had so far to come, ya know?
Anyway, under close scrutiny, it still had that POD sound. Mids are passable, Lows are fake sounding and the Highs are scratchy and inorganic. Don't get me wrong, they have made strides, but they still have a ways to go.
So I turn off my Egnater Rig and hook up my GSP-1101 and show him the dirfferences I hear. He reluctantly admits that the 1101 sounds great, but he doesn't seem to fully grasp the points I am trying to make. In the end he agrees my 1101 is at least as good as his stuff - even though it BLOWS his stuff away - and I agree that the new Line-6 stuff sound way better that the old stuff - hardly any admission on my part :wink:
A couple of months go by and I go see his band play a bar near my house. His tone sound really good. I'm thinking maybe I was too harsh. Maybe this stuff does sound good through a PA. Maybe he isn't off his rocker
So I go up, after his set and what do I see? That's right, DIGITECH stuff in his rack!!!
He went and played with a used one at a Musicgoround and traded his Line-6 rig for it.
I KNEW I was right :lol:
That's my story and I am sticking to it! LOL
Your mileage my vary
H
i use a pod hd 300 in return of my v2 sometimes and my previous 6505+. it sounded good and could easily pass for good all around rig. u have have to hook it up right for it to sound good. no front end or over clean channel ever. use the return of the loop and set it for live / amp setting not studio/line. i did notice since the v2 effects loop isn t line level the line setting on the pod brings more volume but since u can adjust the volume of the return with a knob on the v2 it doesn t seem to matter idk? but the only model i like on the pod is the treadplate. to me the engl , bogner and electrik just dont cut it for anything but the recto is great. i like it in pre amp or full. i hear cab modeling should be avoided but since the 300 cant do this only the mic modeling i never use it live cause the v2 kills. i think the cab modeling is more of an eq curve and doesnt really matter though
GtrGeorge!
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Maybe I missed theboat on all this BUT...
I tried modeling and SS for years..and though it seemed good for recording..or at low volume...at a real drummer volume it just got hairy and starnge sounding. The bad aspects of the tone became proportonally larger as the volume came up..and at the same time the playability became worse....at the same time.
OI have done countless A/B ing (and I take my time and do it right)...the Line6 modeling Fx most recently and ya know what? It still wasnt as good as the original deal.
I find that for the biggest tone, and most dynmically playable sound Tubes and analog gear still win.
I am not Amish about it....I await someone to get it right..but so far, I still use tubes..and yeah I am booked tonight at 9pm.
YMMV but I needed to add my 2 cents
GtrGeorge
I tried modeling and SS for years..and though it seemed good for recording..or at low volume...at a real drummer volume it just got hairy and starnge sounding. The bad aspects of the tone became proportonally larger as the volume came up..and at the same time the playability became worse....at the same time.
OI have done countless A/B ing (and I take my time and do it right)...the Line6 modeling Fx most recently and ya know what? It still wasnt as good as the original deal.
I find that for the biggest tone, and most dynmically playable sound Tubes and analog gear still win.
I am not Amish about it....I await someone to get it right..but so far, I still use tubes..and yeah I am booked tonight at 9pm.
YMMV but I needed to add my 2 cents
GtrGeorge
GtrGeorge!
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Yeah,maximus and I agree...
when the volume comes up...tubes really sound"proper". Alot of modeling or SS fails at high volumes..they are a few rare exceptions...but often SS gets weird at highvolumes.
GtrGeorge
when the volume comes up...tubes really sound"proper". Alot of modeling or SS fails at high volumes..they are a few rare exceptions...but often SS gets weird at highvolumes.
GtrGeorge
