Plexi vs Metroplex

[RMosack]

Hello, new here.
Can anyone please provide any insight on how the Plexi model and the Metroplex model vary?

I have a Mesa Mark V and I’m looking to add a Marshall channel in the effects loop. I’m not particularly looking for hot rodded Van Halen Brown Sound or Appetite Slash sound. I’m looking for something more in the vein of Jimmy Page 1973 or Angus Young.

If anyone is familiar with both modules, can you explain how they each do those classic tones?

 

[RMosack]

And by the way, may as well lump in the Friedman DS module and the BB channel of the Friedman BE-BB module. On the cleaner settings, do those do classic ‘70s Plexi?

 

[Len75]

I have the Plexi and the BE and both are great. The Plexi is more traditional and gives you that Plexi sound but biased and voiced hot. Not really a clean Plexi sound. With my Knaggs Kenai I can turn down the volume on my neck pickup and get it pretty clean but the volume is also lower. Then I can switch to the bridge and have full on classic 70s distortion. Its thick and nasily. BE is similar but when the gain its more brown. I have not played the Dirty Shirly but Im guessing you would have all the early to late 70s tones between the two.

 

[gaboocho]

The Plexi was designed by Dave Friedman to be a cranked up Van Halen plexi.
The Metroplex was designed by George Metropoulos to model his 68' super lead.

 

[jddelux]

I have the DS, 800, and Metroplex and a BoogieMarkIV. Don't have the Plexi and haven't played thru it.
DS is similar to the 800 but tighter darker more compressed sound with more definition, more scooped- deeper bass and crisp trebble that doesn't pierce your ears like the marshall with lots of presence do. Both channels can reach different amounts of gain.
THe 800 has 2 channels with one fat and saturated gain like 80's metal, the other is more like the marshall 800 or jmp-(what AC/DC toured with in 76). The 800 nails the marshall tone and spongy qualities and sounds more classic and open.
THe Metroplex is 2 channels with the same gain ability. Dial one up and one back for dirty and cleaner- it never gets as clean as the DS and 800- think clean on the edge of breakup. Very forward punchy mid focused and thinner sound than DS with a little something( nice sizzle at the top). If I'm playing by myself I prefer the DS, but with a bassist and a band the metroplex's thinner focused sound actually sounds thicked and louder. It gets really ripping and saturated with the gain up and totally nails that 70's rock sound and then some!
All the modules sound really good and the differences are there but you can play thru them and get a variety of great sounds on all of em just a matter of what your ears like best. If you are going thru a boogie- the boogies soound great especially their clean and lead tones, but these modules will give you those punchy marshallesque tones you're missing.
Hope this was helpful.

 

[RMosack]

I have the DS, 800, and Metroplex and a BoogieMarkIV. Don't have the Plexi and haven't played thru it.
DS is similar to the 800 but tighter darker more compressed sound with more definition, more scooped- deeper bass and crisp trebble that doesn't pierce your ears like the marshall with lots of presence do. Both channels can reach different amounts of gain.
THe 800 has 2 channels with one fat and saturated gain like 80's metal, the other is more like the marshall 800 or jmp-(what AC/DC toured with in 76). The 800 nails the marshall tone and spongy qualities and sounds more classic and open.
THe Metroplex is 2 channels with the same gain ability. Dial one up and one back for dirty and cleaner- it never gets as clean as the DS and 800- think clean on the edge of breakup. Very forward punchy mid focused and thinner sound than DS with a little something( nice sizzle at the top). If I'm playing by myself I prefer the DS, but with a bassist and a band the metroplex's thinner focused sound actually sounds thicked and louder. It gets really ripping and saturated with the gain up and totally nails that 70's rock sound and then some!
All the modules sound really good and the differences are there but you can play thru them and get a variety of great sounds on all of em just a matter of what your ears like best. If you are going thru a boogie- the boogies soound great especially their clean and lead tones, but these modules will give you those punchy marshallesque tones you're missing.
Hope this was helpful.

Thank you. That was very helpful. Since I first posted the thread, I did a little more poking around the net. As far as the Friedman amps go, his Dirty Shirley is supposed to be based on a older JTM type Marshall, and his BE is based on a JMP.

I actually found this quote from the previous poster to be very interesting:
The Plexi was designed by Dave Friedman to be a cranked up Van Halen plexi.
The Metroplex was designed by George Metropoulos to model his 68' super lead.
That kind of changes my initial thinking. The simple name "Plexi" would have me guess that the Plexi module was designed to be just that, a basic JMP amp. Interesting that it leans to the "cranked" Plexi thing. Plus, the dual volume controls kind of hinted at original and vintage to me. And I kind of ignorantly guessed that the Metroplex must be some kind of fancy, hot rodded thing because Metropoulos is a famous boutique builder. But I think I had it backwards in my brain. That Metro Plex is designed to be just like a particular old amp.

Hmmm. I have the Plex module. I kind of wish I could try out the Metro Plex too.

 

[mightytheo]

Hi all,

i am also new on this forum. Main reason to join this forum was the fact that i own an Egnater M4 with various modules and several other preamps (GT Trio, Mesa Triaxis, Marshall 9000, Reussenszehn Fender/Marshall preamp) in search of those beautiful vintage tones while maintaining the flexibility that MTS modules appear to give you.

I was particularly interested in the question from rmosac because my current experience with modular preamps is that most of them appear to sound very modern and have a tendency towards hi-gain sounds. And just like rmosac i want to add more vintage sounds to my set of MTS preamps.

In the past, i had a similar experience with Egnater. For example, my existing SL2 module from Egnater does also not allow me to dial a low gain sound that is smooth enough. Unfortunately Egnater does not supply the SL anymore so i am opting for a Synergy module that can provide a more smooth (less harsh) and vintage oriented Marshall sound (actually my Reussenzehn 19" preamp 2nd channel comes very close to what i am searching for but it is not a MTS module).

So my main requirements would be a normal channel that allows met to play Hendrix style licks easily and a treble or jumped channel that provides that pure tube SL '68 alike lead sound without going into JCM territory. It would be highly appreciated to find and purchase the ideal Synergy preamp that fits those requirements...

So if possible, i would like to join this discussion ;-)

 

[Serious_Poo]

Hi all,

i am also new on this forum. Main reason to join this forum was the fact that i own an Egnater M4 with various modules and several other preamps (GT Trio, Mesa Triaxis, Marshall 9000, Reussenszehn Fender/Marshall preamp) in search of those beautiful vintage tones while maintaining the flexibility that MTS modules appear to give you.

I was particularly interested in the question from rmosac because my current experience with modular preamps is that most of them appear to sound very modern and have a tendency towards hi-gain sounds. And just like rmosac i want to add more vintage sounds to my set of MTS preamps.

In the past, i had a similar experience with Egnater. For example, my existing SL2 module from Egnater does also not allow me to dial a low gain sound that is smooth enough. Unfortunately Egnater does not supply the SL anymore so i am opting for a Synergy module that can provide a more smooth (less harsh) and vintage oriented Marshall sound (actually my Reussenzehn 19" preamp 2nd channel comes very close to what i am searching for but it is not a MTS module).

So my main requirements would be a normal channel that allows met to play Hendrix style licks easily and a treble or jumped channel that provides that pure tube SL '68 alike lead sound without going into JCM territory. It would be highly appreciated to find and purchase the ideal Synergy preamp that fits those requirements...

So if possible, i would like to join this discussion ;-)

FWIW, the Metroplex cannot get glassy Marshall clean tones the way Hendrix did. It does not have a clean channel nor can it get clean tones. That said, it's got 2 different gain settings and a shared EQ that give it a lot of flexibility if you're into that classic Marshall sound. It can go from low gain 70's AC/DC / Rush / J Tull rhythm guitar sounds up to a wide variety of 80's metal lead tones (e.g., Ratt, Scorpions, Priest, Ozzy, etc). I don't have the Plexi or other Marshall style modules as the Metro totally covers that for me. It doesn't do "modern" metal at all, the amp voicing is entirely different

Hope that helps.

 

[Mike P]

FWIW, the Metroplex cannot get glassy Marshall clean tones the way Hendrix did. It does not have a clean channel nor can it get clean tones.

No offense but this couldn't be further from the truth. The Metroplex cleans up very nicely and it is not a "high gain" module, especially when used with a Strat. I'll post some clips later today.

 

[RMosack]

After all of the responses, I'm still not clear on which one cleans up and does the lower/lowest gain Plexi thing better: the Plexi or the Metro Plex module.

I have a Plexi module. It's beginning to feel like I need to buy a Metro Plex at some point and simply compare the two.

 

[Monkeyboy23]

"After all of the responses, I'm still not clear on which one cleans up and does the lower/lowest gain Plexi thing better"
Check out the demos on YouTube and pick. That's what I did. The Metro is awesome.

The Metro gets clean with the volume knob on the guitar and does it well. It doesn't really do clean without using the volume knob for me.

I would assume that both do "clean" better since they are designed by Friedman and Metropolis and both know their Plexi inside and out. The Plexi module does have the two gain controls, so maybe it gets clean on its own.

FWIW, both do the modded marshall thing. The Metro is stock gain up until 2 o'clock and then "gets into modded territory" from there (not really a lot more gain, tbh), according to George M.

 

[Serious_Poo]

FWIW, the Metroplex cannot get glassy Marshall clean tones the way Hendrix did. It does not have a clean channel nor can it get clean tones.

No offense but this couldn't be further from the truth. The Metroplex cleans up very nicely and it is not a "high gain" module, especially when used with a Strat. I'll post some clips later today.

None taken, I'd love to hear your samples. Your's might be built a lot different than mine.

FWIW, I'm not talking about playing the guitar with the volume rolled back, but opened all the way up like you would normally play into a clean amp. I mean, pretty much anyone can get a clean(ish) sound from even a an Uberschall or SLO if they rolled the volume back enough, you know? But that wasn't my point. My preamp at it's lower gain settings simply cannot get Hendrixy clean sounds like I can get with an old Marshall Superbass or Superlead does ala "The Wind Cries Mary". I used to have an old plexi Superbass, those amps can get gorgeous glassy clean sounds with tons of headroom at lower gain settings. My Metroplex preamp doesn't even get into the neighborhood of those clean sounds. It starts off overdriven and goes up from there.

 

[Mike P]

None taken, I'd love to hear your samples. Your's might be built a lot different than mine.

My apologies for not posting sooner. I've had some briefs come in since Monday so I'm currently swamped at the moment but I'll definitely post once time permits.

FWIW, I can get really "chimey" Hendrix style tones with the Metroplex Blue Channel, a Fender Custom Shop Mary Kay Strat (Fender 69 pickups) and the gain set at 5 (12 O'clock). If I dial the gain back to around 9 O'Clock, it cleans up nicely and sounds very similar to a "Little Wing" tone.

 

[Serious_Poo]

None taken, I'd love to hear your samples. Your's might be built a lot different than mine.

My apologies for not posting sooner. I've had some briefs come in since Monday so I'm currently swamped at the moment but I'll definitely post once time permits.

FWIW, I can get really "chimey" Hendrix style tones with the Metroplex Blue Channel, a Fender Custom Shop Mary Kay Strat (Fender 69 pickups) and the gain set at 5 (12 O'clock). If I dial the gain back to around 9 O'Clock, it cleans up nicely and sounds very similar to a "Little Wing" tone.

Stock preamp tubes? that's amazing. I'd prefer it if mine did that, but it definitely doesn't. 9 o'clock on mine and you're in AC/DC / Thin Lizzy territory.

 

[mightytheo]

It is very nice to see the amount of useful replies on this topic. Apparently, the Plexi sound intrigues many guitar players including myself ;-)

However, it remains difficult to judge the nuances in sounds and feel of a preamp without trying it yourself. As far as i understood the comments, most of the Synergy modules are voiced in such a way that they also contain the modded, more high-gain variants of a vintage Marshall Super Lead amp.

In my own biased opinion, Plexi modules need to reproduce two main types of sounds which is the JimI Hendrix style bluesy sound (using volume control and neck element) and the typical AC/DC style sound (using the bridge pickup). My primary concern in selecting a module is that it will not sound too shrill or harsh...

But the Sound on Sound magazine also provide information on this typical Marshall Super Lead amp: "The Super Lead is a very bright-sounding amplifier: no modern design comes anywhere near to it for crunchy upper mid-range. There are other circuit factors involved as well, but a lot of the Super Lead's extreme treble comes from the use of a particularly large value 'bright cap' (capacitor) strapped across the lead channel's volume control (channels are actually just labelled I and II). At 5000pF it is more than 10 times the value commonly used in other amps, and it has a profound effect on the way the amp works. Bright caps allow high frequencies to bypass the volume pot, with their effect being greatest at low settings and diminishing eventually to nothing if the pot is turned all the way up. A 5000pF bright cap is passing not just high treble but a lot of mid-range too, so much so that it significantly skews the taper of the volume pot. At 3 on the dial a Super Lead is already rather loud, albeit uncomfortably thin and biting, but the bright cap begins to have less effect as you turn up further, until you reach an absolute 'sweet spot' at about 6. Latterly, there seems to have been a bit of forum mania for snipping the bright caps out of Super Leads, or at least just subbing them for a more conventional value. Admittedly, you probably end up with a more usable amplifier for today's requirements and volume restrictions, but it will no longer be a Super Lead, with its very particular brand of magic."

After reading this comment, i think that i prefer the Metro-Plex since the designer has probably gone more into detail on replicating this behavior in the circuitry?

 

[Elric]

I haven’t played either module but its kind of weird because even though the Metro is based on a vintage Marshall and is even demoed against that very amp by the module maker himself on YT, it seems like a number have claimed that it does not do low gain at all.

 

[RMosack]

Interesting viewpoint.

I have no idea what sort of bright caps are used on the inputs for the Plexi module or the Metro Plex module. Obviously, neither module actually has the high and low inputs, let alone all four! So it's unclear to me how that part of the circuit is implemented.

I do know that the Plexi module does at least have the dual volume controls in some sort of an attempt to mimic the way the actual amp worked, if not internally, then at least from the user's perspective.

The Metro doesn't even have that, so I'm not really clear exactly how George "has probably gone more into detail on replicating this behavior in the circuitry". I wonder what his approach was to going with the single volume control. ?Was he attempting the jumpered input thing, but with some sort of volume compromise? I can't imagine that module is only replicating the treble input. I would imagine that would be very shrill.

 

[Mike P]

My apologies for not posting any clips just yet but as I mentioned earlier, I've (fortunately!) been swamped with work.

That said, I need to walk back my comments a bit. While it's true that I the Metro can clean up nicely with a Strat (in my case, an ash body Mary Kay with Fender 69's and an ash body with Texas Specials), it does not clean up at all with humbuckers. Even with the same settings, Lollar Imperial Low Wounds are on the edge of AC/DC territory while a custom Charvel with a JB is super heavy sounding.

I'm going to try a 5751 tube in the Metro today and will report back, as it should clean up quite a bit, although it'll probably be at the expensive of its top end gain.

 

[Mike P]

I still haven't had a chance to record the Metro for the purpose of an example clip but the Blue Channel is definitely much cleaner with an NOS GE 5751 in V1 and while it doesn't make the Red channel any cleaner, it has "cleaned" up and tightened up the Red Channel considerably.

I placed an order for a new Plexi module yesterday but they're backordered, so it'll be a few weeks before I'm able to do direct-comparison clips but will do so as soon as time permits.

 

[mightytheo]

Thanks for the information which is absolutely helpful. Out of curiosity, why are you also ordering the Plexi module?