Front End Boosting

[ashishk]

Hey hey!

So... this has got me thinking. All these bands you hear of boosting the front end of their tube amps with overdrive pedals, e.g. Killswitch and Shadows, both use OD808 pedals in front of their amps.

So here are my questions:
1. From what I understand, the boosting "drives" the tubes harder, so you get more pick attack and better response. Any truth to this?

2. Does that mean the gain +/- switch on the 1086 kinda mimics this effect?

3. I am running my RM100 with JJ E34Ls running at 40mV, and my main rhythm tone is a Recto module (stock). I love the tone I am getting out of this with my ESP EX-400 loaded with EMG 81/60s. Very Dark Tranquility type tone off the Character album.
Would running an OD pedal in the front help this in any way?

Just curious that's all. You hear about these things all the time but I dont understand the concept behind doing it. A good amp should give you the tone you want without having to add all these things to it.

Cheers,
Ashish

 

[NCdan]

I think the whole point of the MTS series is so you don't need to boost your signal 8) . Sure, if you have a Fender tube amp, the cleans are great, but you just don't have the gain you want, a boost is helpful, but with the MTS, you can change heads on the fly. The only limitation to this is how much money you want to drop: if you owned 2 RM4's, you could have 8 different heads at your disposal, you could even have duplicate moduels with different tones dialed in, giving you that extra drive without having to deal with the extra noise, space, and extra cables you have to deal with when using pedals. I think the best use for a drive pedal is for solo boosts if your setup doesn't have a built-in option for that, so if you're using an RM20 live, then you'd probably like a boost/overdrive pedal, but I think it's unecessary with an RM4.

 

[JKD]

I disagree with that almost entirely...a boost changes the feel and the gain structure...it's like adding a channel to me.

 

[TheHunter]

I use a moded TS-9 all the time and without it i just dont get the drive i want. Im using the 1086 and the recto and I like them both tonally but with a good pedal infront to boost that signal (not color it like an MT2) its awesome, even my black face gain at 10 and a little grit from the TS-9 can send that module into overdriven heaven. So no I think that any head out there is gonna require some form of boost, Most Mesa Rec users have boost just for the fact that the Recs lack that thick juicy drive that the Randall supplies or even a 5150.

Every amp has its own distict charactaristic, adding a little flavor is not gonna kill the amps personality, just adds yours to it.

 

[snatchss454]

I just bought a Keeley Fuzz Head and its just like hunter says, it adds a thickness to it that wasnt there before as well as sustain. Im still waiting on the Treble booster to see how that sounds. I think I may try a Keeley modded metal zone 2 or blues driver also.
Boost It!!
Shane

 

[crankyrayhanky]

I often boost, but the gain I add is next to nothing on the pedal. I'll do this (or at times not do this) for rhythms and leads

 

[maximus1]

the maxon od808 is a good pedal, its pretty natural sounding compared to other ones that have more gain which will seem to add something to the gain structure like jkd said. it has a little bit of a mid hump and just having it in your chain changes the tone a little. of all the tube screamers i've tried the maxon seems to work the best for me but right now i feel like i don't need it, my high gain modules seem to have enough gain and are plenty tight sounding for my tastes at least for now anyway :wink:

 

[okstrat]

I boost if I have to, but at gig volumes I don't really need to. I have a Tri-Boost pedal I built that rocks for pushing the front end, and several self modded tube screamers and super overdrives. It's all good if it works for you!

Pete

 

[ashishk]

I disagree with that almost entirely...a boost changes the feel and the gain structure...it's like adding a channel to me.

Alright... that being said. Do you run the overdrive pedal in conjunction with your 1086/Recto modules all the time?
If you answered yes to the above, why hasn't someone come up with a mod which eliminates the need for the boost pedal? Or, maybe incorporate a switch which activates a boost within the module? Know what I mean?

I just love the concept of being able to shape the tones of the modules by swapping caps and resistors and whatnot. So if I could add in a switch which takes the boost pedal function into account, wouldn't that just be mondo awesome?

 

[okstrat]

I disagree with that almost entirely...a boost changes the feel and the gain structure...it's like adding a channel to me.

Alright... that being said. Do you run the overdrive pedal in conjunction with your 1086/Recto modules all the time?
If you answered yes to the above, why hasn't someone come up with a mod which eliminates the need for the boost pedal? Or, maybe incorporate a switch which activates a boost within the module? Know what I mean?

I just love the concept of being able to shape the tones of the modules by swapping caps and resistors and whatnot. So if I could add in a switch which takes the boost pedal function into account, wouldn't that just be mondo awesome?

Actually, a lot of people use the boost pedal because it adds another tone to their rig too... You can set up a plexi for enough gain for a semi crunch tone, then hit a boost pedal and you have enough gain for solos. Back off your volume on your guitar with the pedal off and you have a passable clean.

Pete

 

[JKD]

I disagree with that almost entirely...a boost changes the feel and the gain structure...it's like adding a channel to me.

Alright... that being said. Do you run the overdrive pedal in conjunction with your 1086/Recto modules all the time?
If you answered yes to the above, why hasn't someone come up with a mod which eliminates the need for the boost pedal? Or, maybe incorporate a switch which activates a boost within the module? Know what I mean?

I just love the concept of being able to shape the tones of the modules by swapping caps and resistors and whatnot. So if I could add in a switch which takes the boost pedal function into account, wouldn't that just be mondo awesome?

I used to boost all the time...then I realized it didn't always sound that great and I think my playing style changed a little after switching the boosts off.

Now I just boost when I want a little bit more oompf....usually at lower volumes. (I only play at home.)

The reason boosts aren't built in....well, look at all the flavours of boost/overdrive pedal there are...would you care to just have one type built into the head?

 

[ashishk]

I disagree with that almost entirely...a boost changes the feel and the gain structure...it's like adding a channel to me.

Alright... that being said. Do you run the overdrive pedal in conjunction with your 1086/Recto modules all the time?
If you answered yes to the above, why hasn't someone come up with a mod which eliminates the need for the boost pedal? Or, maybe incorporate a switch which activates a boost within the module? Know what I mean?

I just love the concept of being able to shape the tones of the modules by swapping caps and resistors and whatnot. So if I could add in a switch which takes the boost pedal function into account, wouldn't that just be mondo awesome?

I used to boost all the time...then I realized it didn't always sound that great and I think my playing style changed a little after switching the boosts off.

Now I just boost when I want a little bit more oompf....usually at lower volumes. (I only play at home.)

The reason boosts aren't built in....well, look at all the flavours of boost/overdrive pedal there are...would you care to just have one type built into the head?

Haha! Good point. Silly me...

How does boosting work tho? Is the signal from the guitar changed, e.g. follows the EQ curve imparted by the pedal, maybe a slight volume boost and this is then effected by the module?

Are the preamp tubes driven more or am I missing some fundamental concept about boosting?

 

[Mailman1971]

I often boost, but the gain I add is next to nothing on the pedal. I'll do this (or at times not do this) for rhythms and leads

+1 on that!
The Randall Rep I talked to explained that it just boosted the Voltage for the signal which made total sense. I dont use it for Distortion but for the increased Voltage that makes that Signal JUMP!!
I just started boosting using very little gain on the Boss SD-1 I been using. Its a excellent solo boost or just a "Edge"
I am surprised I havent been doing it for years! Works wonders on the Marshall style modules. I use it slightly on the Mr. Scary and it Just BRINGS tone! That is coming from a ANTI Pedal user!!
Rock on Brothers.......... 8)

 

[khingpynn]

I boost a lot... mostly a slight dirt boost with a little volumn hike.

 

[paul525715]

I have my RM4 in the loop of my GT-Pro. I set my patches with different send and return levels to give me infinite tones from my modules. If I need a bit more bite I increase the send and reduce the return. Vice versa if I want a low gain sound. Works well.

 

[ashishk]

Thanks for the input y'all.

My other guitarist is getting an OD-808 to boost the crunch channel on his Framus Cobra. I will try his pedal out on my setup sometime soon too, and then see what difference it makes.

Cheers,
Ashish

 

[khingpynn]

1. From what I understand, the boosting "drives" the tubes harder, so you get more pick attack and better response. Any truth to this?

2. Does that mean the gain +/- switch on the 1086 kinda mimics this effect?

3. I am running my RM100 with JJ E34Ls running at 40mV, and my main rhythm tone is a Recto module (stock). I love the tone I am getting out of this with my ESP EX-400 loaded with EMG 81/60s. Very Dark Tranquility type tone off the Character album.
Would running an OD pedal in the front help this in any way?

Just curious that's all. You hear about these things all the time but I dont understand the concept behind doing it. A good amp should give you the tone you want without having to add all these things to it.

Two types of boost... clean and dirt...

Boosting the strenth of the signal in with a clean boost can result in more distortion especially from a tube amp... a stronger signal will drive tubes harder. It will depend where the tube is at that time in it's performance. Is it allready clipping moderatly, barely clipping, has more headroom and is not close to clipping.

Dirt boost from a tube preamp or a SS preamp will cause the gain characteristics of that preamp to be added onto the main signal.
In this case there is not allways necassarilly a signal boost or in other words a clean boost component.

For me it's a marriage of both as I like there to be a clean boost with some clipping from the preamp added to the main signal... especially if I'm after that hot dimed out Plexi or JCM 800 tone.

Craig

 

[metalmm785]

Another thing that you have to consider is that due to the eq of the boost/od pedal that you use, you can use it to just tighten up the low end.
Not adding distortion at all. A godsend when you want a little faster tracking with amps like Rectifiers and Uberschalls (or pretty much any amp that has a lot of low mids and bass).

 

[ButchieT]

I use a DOD bi fet preamp all the time on any channel just for the sparkle it puts in and either a Zvex SHO clean boost or a Don Butler ToneMan Rangemaster for boosting solos!
Boost it man!!
Butch

 

[randalls4ever]

I boost for different variations. Like Okstrat said, I use them with mods like the Plexi to get varying gain from it. Also, I like the tone some things change such as the EMG Afterburner I installed in one guitar or the BBE Boosta Grande. They just add to it and make it a different flavor so to speak.