Just got an RM20 what modded module first???

[GuitarGuyLP]

I just got an RM20 combo with a Voodoo SL+ deluxe sear mod. It sounds quite good, but it is a bit of a one trick pony. I am looking to get a more versatile module. I play mostly high gain, so clean is not really needed. I have had and liked a dual rectifier, MKIV, ENGL E530, Peters warhawk, Mako Mak4 (makoplex channel is currently my favorite sound!!).

The modules I am looking for advice on are

Jadded Faith - XTC
Salvation - Chupacabra, or Marsh-oldano

I am looking for versatility, and something that is not too dark. What can you recommend for me?? I am looking to buy used if possible. I don't really play out at all any more, so I am looking to get rid of my rack, and just have the RM20, then buy an RM50, or RM100 later if I start jamming again.

Thanks

Ryan

 

[rhequiem]

Out of the modules you mentioned, I'd recommend the Mash-Oldano - though I'm not sure how ENGL'y or Recto'y it will get. You might want to consider picking up 2-3 different modules based on those tones. You might also consider getting an EQ pedal, which could add lower/higher end to whatever module you choose to start out with. Also, there's been some RM100s popping up for quite affordable prices lately

 

[Kapo_Polenton]

Why not a Grail? Good stocker right there..

 

[BigBrewtus]

Most versatile stocker IMO is the 1086 now dubbed the Plexi-Plus. Lots of modded modules that are versatile. Jump in and try em out.
Welcome to MTS bro!

 

[GuitarGuyLP]

Thanks for the advice. I will check them out, but I should give a bit of background. This is actually my second try at MTS. I had an RM100, and a pre dual channel M4. All my modules were stock The Egnater modules were lower gain, and the Randall modules just couldn't beat my VHT, or Peters, and the price of modded modules scared me off a bit.

This time around I want to see what these are capable of, and so far the XTC sound clips seem to be the best to me. There is something about them.

I will check out the 1086 as well since I have been researching modded modules mostly. I might just pull the trigger on a Jaded Faith XTC new, and do a shootout between that and the Voodoo modded SL+. The other thing that I am liking about the XTC in particular is how many options there are, Plexi, Red, Blue, and Structure for the red/blue.

 

[BigBrewtus]

Never had a JF XTC personally but have had many a stock and modded XTCs. I loved them all. They all had just that right amount of cut and gain structure that I just dig. Have fun!!

 

[GuitarGuyLP]

That is what I want to hear about XTCs!!! I am thinking that if I can't find a used modded XTC by the end of the weekend I am going to shell out the $330 or so for a new one from Jaded Faith with a donor module. I am starting to dig the sear module, but I think it is not quite as good as my Makoplex channel in my Mak4 preamp.

 

[Mike P]

I am starting to dig the sear module, but I think it is not quite as good as my Makoplex channel in my Mak4 preamp.

How so? What tubes are you using in your module and head? Also, keep in mind that with an RM20, you're at 15 watts with EL84 tubes, which will definitely sound different than a head or power amp rated at a high wattage with EL34's or 6L6's.

 

[LunatiBSW]

Yes Mike P is correct. My rm100 sounds light years better than my rm20

 

[Mike P]

I just checked out the demos for the Mako Amps - pretty freakin' killer high gain Plexi sounds! Serious price tag, however.

If that's what you're looking for in tone, I'm sure that you'll be able to find something that suits your needs in a modded module, although you're always going to be a little behind the curve due to the EL84's.

 

[Mike P]

If you're going for the Engl tone, the Salvation Angel is the go-to module for that sound. I had an Engl Screamer 50 and sold it after receiving the Angel because I was able to dial in an identical sound.

 

[alowerdeep]

I just checked out the demos for the Mako Amps - pretty freakin' killer high gain Plexi sounds! Serious price tag, however.

If that's what you're looking for in tone, I'm sure that you'll be able to find something that suits your needs in a modded module, although you're always going to be a little behind the curve due to the EL84's.

Yeah,we got an endorsement offer with them a few years ago....hhe made all of his amp ptp then....dont know if that has changed,but I remember then sounding great....

 

[GuitarGuyLP]

When I was comparing the Mak4 to the RM20 I was running the Mak4 into the FX return of the RM20. It actually sounds great with the scumback speaker I put in the RM20!!! So the power amp was the same only difference was the front end. I have almost decided to pick up the Chupacabra, and look for an XTC.

20 watts is plenty for me for recording, and just playing at home. I might get an RM50 eventually, but I have never been a fan of 100 watt heads. I like 20, and 50 watters better. I am one of the rare people who likes a bit of power tube grind with my high gain amps.

In the RM20 I have a mix of EI, Chinese 12AX7B, and JJs. Groove tubes EL84s are the power tubes for now. I have them biased hot 18mA, but I am going to try them a bit colder later 15.5mA.

I also think that I have to turn down the gain on the internal pot and crank the front gain, and use the boost if I need to go over the top. My main problem with the Voodoo mod is that there are not many options on the front. If you look at the Chupacabra it has two three way switches, 9 combinations!!!! The Jaded Faith XTC has a plexi switch, and two two way switches. 5 combinations. Much more tweaking available.

 

[Mike P]

When I was comparing the Mak4 to the RM20 I was running the Mak4 into the FX return of the RM20. It actually sounds great with the scumback speaker I put in the RM20!!! So the power amp was the same only difference was the front end. I have almost decided to pick up the Chupacabra, and look for an XTC.

Oh, so you have an RM20C?

20 watts is plenty for me for recording, and just playing at home. I might get an RM50 eventually, but I have never been a fan of 100 watt heads. I like 20, and 50 watters better. I am one of the rare people who likes a bit of power tube grind with my high gain amps.

Actually, they're only 15 watts. EL84's are 7.5 watts each. I prefer 100 watt heads over 50 watt heads due to the output transformer having more headroom. If you stick with the RM20, I'd recommend upgrading the transformers to Mercury Magnetics. You'll have an awesome little rig!

In the RM20 I have a mix of EI, Chinese 12AX7B, and JJs. Groove tubes EL84s are the power tubes for now. I have them biased hot 18mA, but I am going to try them a bit colder later 15.5mA.

Trace (Voodoo Amps) recommends and uses ARS12ax7's in his modules (they're used by Bogner & Friedman as well) and older Sovtek WXT+ EL84's. I couldn't find any when I briefly used an RM20 and chose Mullard's instead. IMO, the difference between the stock JJ's and the ARS/Mullard combination was HUGE. There was so much more depth and clarity with the ARS/Mullards and the amp came alive. The next step, which I didn't take, would have been to upgrade the transformers to Mercury Magnetics. Instead, I bought an RM100.

I also think that I have to turn down the gain on the internal pot and crank the front gain, and use the boost if I need to go over the top. My main problem with the Voodoo mod is that there are not many options on the front. If you look at the Chupacabra it has two three way switches, 9 combinations!!!! The Jaded Faith XTC has a plexi switch, and two two way switches. 5 combinations. Much more tweaking available.

Some of the modules, for better or worse, have so many switches and settings that it can become really frustrating to dial in a great sound. I prefer simple with a great tone. Others like the options...

 

[GuitarGuyLP]

I never use the general output ratings of tubes since it depends a lot on the circuit. I have seen 6l6 amps rated from 40-60 watts, and there is a vintage traynor that uses two EL34s for 90watts!!!!

The Randall web site states 18 watts, but there are so many variables, and 3 watts one way, or another doesn't make too much of a difference. I am going to research the transformers a bit to see what options there are.

I actually like having different options, and switches. Once you get a feel for them you can really dial in a lot of different tones. I can see how that is a double edge sword though.

 

[GuitarGuyLP]

Anyone know the specs of the RM20 output transformer. I can't find the mercury magnetics one, and I might check to see if there are other upgrade options.

 

[Mike P]

I never use the general output ratings of tubes since it depends a lot on the circuit. I have seen 6l6 amps rated from 40-60 watts, and there is a vintage traynor that uses two EL34s for 90watts!!!!

Well, the bottom line is the EL34's are 25 watts, 6L6's are 30 watts and EL84's are 7.5 watts. An amp's circuit may make those less efficient by lowering the voltage but that's a entirely different topic altogether.

The Randall web site states 18 watts, but there are so many variables, and 3 watts one way, or another doesn't make too much of a difference. I am going to research the transformers a bit to see what options there are.

Not to beat a dead horse but the Randall site states 15 watts: http://www.randallamplifiers.com/Amplifiers/MTS-Heads/Page-2.html

Go for the Mercury Magnetics Radio Spares. They're pricey and if you're not an amp tech, you'll need someone to replace them but it'll be well worth it.

I actually like having different options, and switches. Once you get a feel for them you can really dial in a lot of different tones. I can see how that is a double edge sword though.

That's cool. I'm generally searching for one sound from each module, not a plethora of sounds. Having owned all of the amp forms of the modded modules I currently have, I know exactly what I want from each. The extra options can sometimes help with matching to the original head but in many cases, they aren't even used.

Good luck!

 

[GuitarGuyLP]

The randall site states 18 watts for the RM22, and the RM20 combo, but 15 watts for the RM20 head. But as I said it doesn't make a big difference any ways.

I am just curious about the 7.5 watt value for EL84s. I don't want to come off as a dick about it, but the plate dissipation of an EL84 is 12 watts a tube. As an Electronics engineering tech I am a bit picky about data sheets. Also that is how the Peavey classic 50/50 gets 50watts / channel out of EL84s. But due to circuit design it can be 18, or 15, or less depending on the operating conditions. There are a lot of Marshall 18 watt amps using EL84s.

I am not too worried about the power output of this amp since I might eventually get an RM50. I am going to do some serious looking into upgrading the OT since compared to a 50, or 100 watt amp it is a small transformer, and should be reasonably priced.

 

[Mike P]

The randall site states 18 watts for the RM22, and the RM20 combo, but 15 watts for the RM20 head. But as I said it doesn't make a big difference any ways.

I am just curious about the 7.5 watt value for EL84s. I don't want to come off as a dick about it, but the plate dissipation of an EL84 is 12 watts a tube. As an Electronics engineering tech I am a bit picky about data sheets. Also that is how the Peavey classic 50/50 gets 50watts / channel out of EL84s. But due to circuit design it can be 18, or 15, or less depending on the operating conditions. There are a lot of Marshall 18 watt amps using EL84s.

I am not too worried about the power output of this amp since I might eventually get an RM50. I am going to do some serious looking into upgrading the OT since compared to a 50, or 100 watt amp it is a small transformer, and should be reasonably priced.

No worries, Dude, it's all good. I've read where EL84's, depending on plate dissipation and amp design, can get anywhere from 17-25 watts. But with the Randall, it's between 7.5-9 watts.

 

[GuitarGuyLP]

I think since it says 15 watts in some places, and 18 in others I might go over to Rig Talk and ask Bruce since I am sure he designed it as well. He should have the definitive answer not that it really matters, but it seems to me like Randall isn't even sure

I am sure that Bruce might also be able to give me some info about the transformer...I have a Hammond that might work if the primaries are the same...I might even look into installing power scaling into this amp, but I might be better off waiting until I get a 50 watter to do those mods to unless I find a module that really kills in the RM20.