More GCX/GCP Woes

[Mattfig]

Thanks for the tip mojo....It would have been more helpful yesterday as I bent the **** out of my first RM4... :twisted: lol

OK, this is getting VERY frustrating....I ripped apart my rack, changed all the dip switches so that RM4s were properly labeled on channels 1 thru 3...Couldn't get much else to happen...

Called Voodoo Labs support and spent about 20 minutes going thru some different options...The support guy told me there's no way to set it up with the banks the way we discussed here at MTS...So he had me setup Rm4a and RM4b using instant access buttons...That worked but I'm still screwed because there's only 8 instant access buttons and I have 12 modules...

Do you guys actually have yours set up so that each bank will switch modules with each preset? Something isn't right here and I don't know what it is...

Any further help is much appreciated...When I ended my tech support call - he told me to take RM4c and put it to MIDI channel 16???? Why???
Did I just get a guy who isn't that familiar with Randall and GCP?

Thanks,
Matt

 

[SacredGroove]

You should probably use 10preset/bank option. You could divide the presets up by yourself, like 0-9 clean, 10-19 dirty rhythm, 20-29 lead. That's similar to what I do. 4 presets and X instant switches didn't work for me, and probably won't for you with 12 modules.

 

[Mattfig]

Thanks bro...

 

[Baco]

Called Voodoo Labs support and spent about 20 minutes going thru some different options...The support guy told me there's no way to set it up with the banks the way we discussed here at MTS...So he had me setup Rm4a and RM4b using instant access buttons...That worked but I'm still screwed because there's only 8 instant access buttons and I have 12 modules...

Indeed, the RM4 can handle both CC's (what he told you to do by using the IA buttons) and PC's, but I really don't see why you would use CC's since you have only 8 IA buttons which have a fixed function across all the presets that you make.

Bear with me for a moment and follow these steps:

Configure your RM4's and GCPro:
- Set the working mode for your GCPro to 4presets/bank (so that you can use the IA's to visually check the activated loop, more on that later)
- Set your MIDI channels seperately for each RM4, which you have done now
- Create 3 Devices in your GCPro: RM4a, RM4b, etc with the corresponding MIDI channels you've assigned them AND make sure you set that they start at 1 (very important!!!!), see page 6 and 7 of the manual of the GCPro if you don't know how to do that

And now the presets:

- Create a Preset (let's use bank 0 for RM4a, bank 1 for RM4b etc) that transmits Program Change 1 for RM4a, the other devices should show -- (meaning no PC to transmit), so this would be preset 01 -> THIS SHOULD SELECT MODULE 1 on RM4a
- Create a Preset (let's use bank 0 for RM4a, bank 1 for RM4b etc) that transmits Program Change 2 for RM4a, the other devices should show -- (meaning no PC to transmit), so this would be preset 02 -> THIS SHOULD SELECT MODULE 2 on RM4a
- Create a Preset (let's use bank 0 for RM4a, bank 1 for RM4b etc) that transmits Program Change 3 for RM4a, the other devices should show -- (meaning no PC to transmit), so this would be preset 03 -> THIS SHOULD SELECT MODULE 3 on RM4a
- Create a Preset (let's use bank 0 for RM4a, bank 1 for RM4b etc) that transmits Program Change 4 for RM4a, the other devices should show -- (meaning no PC to transmit), so this would be preset 04 -> THIS SHOULD SELECT MODULE 4 on RM4a

How to do the above steps: select your bank with the Bank UP/Dn switches, then select your preset. If you select a preset, for instance number 1, make sure that all IA's are turned OFF so that you're only transmitting the values I stated above!!! Then hold down the EDIT button to enter EDIT mode and the display will show the first device and the program number it will transmit, edit when needed (should be RM4A - 01 for preset 01, RM4A - 02 for preset 2 and so on). To go to the next DEVICE use SELECT down until you did what I mentioned above. Hit EDIT again and then save your preset.

Try this and let me know what this does, ok? What you now did is mimic what the standard controller does that's included with the RM4. We'll go from there then.

Really, this is no rocket science, just plain simple MIDI implementation. If this doesn't work then this means that your RM4 isn't responding to the factory programmed program changes. What to do then:

- Select preset 01 on your GCPro
- Select module 1 on your RM4a
- Hold down the select button for a couple of seconds on your RM4a to store the preset, now program change 1 should be linked to module 1

- Select preset 02 on your GCPro
- Select module 2 on your RM4a
- Hold down the select button for a couple of seconds on your RM4a to store the preset, now program change 1 should be linked to module 1

Do the same for module 3 and 4

Check if this works and report back :wink:

Good luck and if this works we can go to the next step to make your rig work. Hang on, we'll get there :wink:

 

[Mattfig]

Called Voodoo Labs support and spent about 20 minutes going thru some different options...The support guy told me there's no way to set it up with the banks the way we discussed here at MTS...So he had me setup Rm4a and RM4b using instant access buttons...That worked but I'm still screwed because there's only 8 instant access buttons and I have 12 modules...

Indeed, the RM4 can handle both CC's (what he told you to do by using the IA buttons) and PC's, but I really don't see why you would use CC's since you have only 8 IA buttons which have a fixed function across all the presets that you make.

Bear with me for a moment and follow these steps:

Configure your RM4's and GCPro:
- Set the working mode for your GCPro to 4presets/bank (so that you can use the IA's to visually check the activated loop, more on that later)
- Set your MIDI channels seperately for each RM4, which you have done now
- Create 3 Devices in your GCPro: RM4a, RM4b, etc with the corresponding MIDI channels you've assigned them AND make sure you set that they start at 1 (very important!!!!), see page 6 and 7 of the manual of the GCPro if you don't know how to do that

And now the presets:

- Create a Preset (let's use bank 0 for RM4a, bank 1 for RM4b etc) that transmits Program Change 1 for RM4a, the other devices should show -- (meaning no PC to transmit), so this would be preset 01 -> THIS SHOULD SELECT MODULE 1 on RM4a
- Create a Preset (let's use bank 0 for RM4a, bank 1 for RM4b etc) that transmits Program Change 2 for RM4a, the other devices should show -- (meaning no PC to transmit), so this would be preset 02 -> THIS SHOULD SELECT MODULE 2 on RM4a
- Create a Preset (let's use bank 0 for RM4a, bank 1 for RM4b etc) that transmits Program Change 3 for RM4a, the other devices should show -- (meaning no PC to transmit), so this would be preset 03 -> THIS SHOULD SELECT MODULE 3 on RM4a
- Create a Preset (let's use bank 0 for RM4a, bank 1 for RM4b etc) that transmits Program Change 4 for RM4a, the other devices should show -- (meaning no PC to transmit), so this would be preset 04 -> THIS SHOULD SELECT MODULE 4 on RM4a

How to do the above steps: select your bank with the Bank UP/Dn switches, then select your preset. If you select a preset, for instance number 1, make sure that all IA's are turned OFF so that you're only transmitting the values I stated above!!! Then hold down the EDIT button to enter EDIT mode and the display will show the first device and the program number it will transmit, edit when needed (should be RM4A - 01 for preset 01, RM4A - 02 for preset 2 and so on). To go to the next DEVICE use SELECT down until you did what I mentioned above. Hit EDIT again and then save your preset.

Try this and let me know what this does, ok? What you now did is mimic what the standard controller does that's included with the RM4. We'll go from there then.

Really, this is no rocket science, just plain simple MIDI implementation. If this doesn't work then this means that your RM4 isn't responding to the factory programmed program changes. What to do then:

- Select preset 01 on your GCPro
- Select module 1 on your RM4a
- Hold down the select button for a couple of seconds on your RM4a to store the preset, now program change 1 should be linked to module 1

- Select preset 02 on your GCPro
- Select module 2 on your RM4a
- Hold down the select button for a couple of seconds on your RM4a to store the preset, now program change 1 should be linked to module 1

Do the same for module 3 and 4

Check if this works and report back :wink:

Good luck and if this works we can go to the next step to make your rig work. Hang on, we'll get there :wink:

Wow...That is awesome...Very generous of you to give me such specifics! Thanks for going above and beyond to help me out and for taking the time to provide such a comprehensive answer...

 

[Mattfig]

Wow...Thank you guys...Especially Baco for such in depth assistance to a MIDIot such as myself...Everything is working...Except for the RT2/50....I can't get it to change with each bank...In fact it doesn't seem to change with any program...I'm gonna scour the manuals tonight as I suspect it will come down to something simple, I hope...Just thought I'd say thanks and post my progress....It's very exciting to have all this stuff working in sync....Obviously I've never used MIDI beyond its most basic BASIC applications so this entire thing has been informative and fun...But I gotta say, MIDI makes me crazy....Until you guys broke it down, I just wasn't understanding anything...And the Voodoo tech only confused me further....

I see the light!

Now how do I program RT changes?

Updated to say I tried the "hold the button down for 3 seconds" thing to setup my channels....Did not work...WTF....

 

[Mattfig]

OK, duh....The RT2/50 is confused because 3 RM4s are sending different signals for the same slots in other RM4s...

Should I make those my IAs? Wow, I feel so MIDI cool...Like I may actually be getting this...Funny...I have a studio full of gear and don't know MIDI...Been fighting it since the late 80s when I first picked up a guitar...

If I do need to make them IAs....How? OK, now I feel dumb again... 8)

 

[Baco]

So you now can control the 3 RM4's independently?

Regarding the poweramp, I sadly don't have any experience with these. Can you set the MIDI channel for the poweramp?

 

[Mattfig]

So you now can control the 3 RM4's independently?

Regarding the poweramp, I sadly don't have any experience with these. Can you set the MIDI channel for the poweramp?

Well independently enough to make it work but I still see module changing going on on the other 2 RM4s that are not in use...However, each bank works well with each module...And the RT should be easy to program in but I can't get it to take...Strange 'cause it works great with one RM4 and a Randall footswitch..I've tried reprogramming, holding down buttons and switches, etc...I guess I'll have to figure something out - probably setup two IA buttons if I can...

Ohhhh wait....You mean set up the RT like another device such as RM4a and so on...I haven't even opened her up and set the dip switch (of there is one)...Guess I better do my homework... So, now my question is - does the RT get its own MIDI channel (4?) or do I somehow tie it to the RM4s?

Thanks, almost there!!!!

 

[muudrock]

I believe if you cycle thru the RM4 in the GCP you can choose "no module" At least I can do this on the M4. On the GCP, click and hold "edit", use the down switch to choose which RM4 you want to edit and use the up and down selector switches to cycle thru the modules. On my M4, at the end of the cycle, it will go to no modules selected (no module lights up) and the preamp is essentially muted. I don't see why this wouldn't be the same for the RM4 as well.

As for setting up the power amp to respond globally:
You can set it to the MIDI channel of one of the other devices but it may only repsond when that particular RM4 is being accessed or responding to MIDI changes. I'd set it to it's own MIDI channel if you want it to switch independent of RM4s switching programming. I believe I have mine set up on Ch 16 w/ M4 on Ch1, Mod50 on CH2, Gmaj2 on Ch3 and Mod 100 on Ch4. I programmed each device into the GCP on its own MIDI channel so that I can use all 3 amps or only 1 or 2 and the RT is always receiving program changes from the GCP via the M4. IIRC, I run a MIDI cable from the MIDI thru on the M4 into the MIDI in of the RT. Of course you still need to select and save which channel of the RT you want to use with each module. It's worked great for me set up like this. Only difference between your setup and mine is I have one preamp and 2 modular heads instead of 3 preamps. I feed the out (or FX send) of all 3 into a CAE line mixer for the ability to blend sounds and send that out to the FX then back into the line mixer out to the RT.

MIDI CHANNEL SELECTION: The MIDI Channel (1 -16) is selected via an internal four position DIP switch (S1). The MIDI Channel must be selected with the power off.

CHAN. S1-4 S1-3 S1-2 S1-1
1 on on on on
2 on on on off
3 on on off on
4 on on off off
5 on off on on
6 on off on off
7 on off off on
8 on off off off
9 off on on on
10 off on on off
11 off on off on
12 off on off off
13 off off on on
14 off off on off
15 off off off on
16 off off off off

Well independently enough to make it work but I still see module changing going on on the other 2 RM4s that are not in use...However, each bank works well with each module...And the RT should be easy to program in but I can't get it to take...Strange 'cause it works great with one RM4 and a Randall footswitch..I've tried reprogramming, holding down buttons and switches, etc...I guess I'll have to figure something out - probably setup two IA buttons if I can...

Ohhhh wait....You mean set up the RT like another device such as RM4a and so on...I haven't even opened her up and set the dip switch (of there is one)...Guess I better do my homework... Smile So, now my question is - does the RT get its own MIDI channel (4?) or do I somehow tie it to the RM4s?

Thanks, almost there!!!!

[/b]

 

[Mattfig]

Thanks muudrock!

OK, let me begin by saying thanks again to all who've guided me thru this process...I gotta say...Lotsa you guys went out of your way to provide in-depth help....Everything is working perfectly and I now LOVE my GCP/GCX....Wow...It's so cool to hit a switch, see the module name come up on the screen and have all switching setup just happen....It makes my rig complete and it's the coolest thing....MIDI still pisses me off...But now I've at least become able to harness the true power of the GCX/GCP...THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!!

 

[Baco]

Very glad to hear everything works now, that's quit rig you got there :wink:

 

[Mattfig]

Very glad to hear everything works now, that's quit rig you got there :wink:

Thanks for all you've done too Baco! Without your help, I would not have had this together yet and would also be VERY frustrated...Now my rig is a full functioning monster and I am so glad not to have to lean down repeatedly during a session to select proper channels...

BTW, for anyone in the future who reads this seeking GCX/GCP help....One important note to add is that, at least for me, I had to run a seven pin MIDI cable into RM4a to make it come to life...Actually I used a 7 pin going into the first RM and a 5 pin coming out of the GCX...(Conversion cable 7pin to 5 pin)...Don't know why as I thought the extra pins were just for powering a pedal but once I did this, things started working...

 

[antag]

Also for the screw above the tubes (top left) you'll need a smaller bit, since it's actually a bolt (because otherwise you'd have a screwpoint sticking out into where you're rummaging around with your hands).

Ah, that explains where it came from! There was a little bolt/nut loose in the box of my RM4 & a screw missing from the front panel.

Obviously someone had the top off it, screwed the screws back into all the top holes, couldn't figure out where the bolt was meant to go, so just left it in the box.

Strangely the bolt doesn't sit flush in the hole - it's the wrong shape for the countersink - so I just left it out - the panel is secured by around 25 other screws so I'm sure it won't matter!