Rising Farce
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Jaded Faith said:
Amen.
Synergy has landed
- Thread starter webrthomson
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Amen.
webrthomson
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So I've (badly) thrown together a quick video of the Synergy VH4 module running into the VH4 power section:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjITBtCYpHY
Basically it's some chugging and cycling the three channels from the VH4's channel 3 to the red and blue channels in the module itself.
Everything is at noon on the module and the amp - except the amp channel and master volumes, which are between 8 and 9 o'clock.
In terms of what is what:
Red Light on left of SYN-2 active = VH4 channel 3
Blue light on VH4 module = VH4 module blue channel
Red light on VH4 module = VH4 module red channel
In the room they all sound great - the amp is a tiny bit louder - but there is not much in it and I think the red channel has a bit more gain than the blue on the module.
The noise floor on all is great - I click through a bit to try and let you guys hear the difference, really the only one you can hear anything on is the red module channel though.
There does not seem as marked a difference as on the amp between channels 3 and 4 on the module as there is a bit more compression on channel 4 of the actual amp.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjITBtCYpHY
Basically it's some chugging and cycling the three channels from the VH4's channel 3 to the red and blue channels in the module itself.
Everything is at noon on the module and the amp - except the amp channel and master volumes, which are between 8 and 9 o'clock.
In terms of what is what:
Red Light on left of SYN-2 active = VH4 channel 3
Blue light on VH4 module = VH4 module blue channel
Red light on VH4 module = VH4 module red channel
In the room they all sound great - the amp is a tiny bit louder - but there is not much in it and I think the red channel has a bit more gain than the blue on the module.
The noise floor on all is great - I click through a bit to try and let you guys hear the difference, really the only one you can hear anything on is the red module channel though.
There does not seem as marked a difference as on the amp between channels 3 and 4 on the module as there is a bit more compression on channel 4 of the actual amp.
webrthomson said:
Nice man, that sounds insanely close....and I love that the EQ is at NOON..if the tone don't sounds great at 12 o'clock, then the EQ is poorly designed!
Did I hear Eye of the Beholder in there? \m/
However, your vid reinforces that my VH4 is/was faulty......really impatient to wait for a repair :-/
webrthomson
Well-known member
JKD said:
Yup they are really close and I agree, none of the Diezels I've played need much movement from about noon at all!
You did indeed hear some Eye of the Beholder!
VH4 is a great amp - get it fixed and get ripping
webrthomson
Well-known member
Uploaded some quick and dirty phone clips of the SLO modules:
Everything at noon on the Synergy SLO and the JF SLOD-100:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFW79yoFDBc
After about a 10 second fiddle to make them sound more alike:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YiaT7TE46w
Everything at noon on the Synergy SLO and the JF SLOD-100:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFW79yoFDBc
After about a 10 second fiddle to make them sound more alike:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YiaT7TE46w
webrthomson said:
Great stuff man.
I found with my Salvado that it sounded most similar to the SLO with the EQ set very close..though the Salvado has more gain / maybe perceptible high gain because has a little more sizzle.
webrthomson
Well-known member
JKD said:
Thanks
I've not tried the Salvado, would like to!
Loving the new Synergy stuff - the guys ahve done a great job on it. I also love the fact my modded stuff sounds great through it too!
webrthomson
Well-known member
keg8605 said:
I've not actually tried it in the loop of the MOD50 yet - I'll do so over the next few days and report back!
withmittens
Well-known member
to me the two sound very different in presence amounts. While the tone and gain structure sound very similar, the Synergy sounds more present and brighter/clearer. I also hear this change a bit throughout, so maybe it;s the microphone being blocked or things moving around in the room.
anyone else hear this?
thanks a ton for the demos. extremely helpful
anyone else hear this?
thanks a ton for the demos. extremely helpful
Mattfig
Well-known member
withmittens said:
Oh yeah, the JF sounds very dark and muffled compared to the Syn mod...But tonally they sound like they could be close when dialed in...
Capt_Tippy
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Mattfig said:
Lets just be honest. The JF sounds like junk compared to the Synergy. Of course... who knows why? Bad tubes? Bad settings? Bad gas from too much cheese? Nobody knows, but... in this particular video, if its accurate, I'd be shocked if Rob ever sold another one.
Jaded Faith
Well-known member
Very nice demo and I think it does a nice job answering some questions. I will point out three things to consider however:
1: For a true apples-to-apples comparison, the Synergy SLO needs to have the cathode bias switch set to the Fender position. The 1K8/1uF default SLO Synergy setting provides a high frequency shelving boost that starts to roll off at 2K and is -3db down around 150hZ. The Randall default is 1K5/22uF, which is essentially full frequency and only starts to roll off around 100hZ. This is the perceived difference in brightness at the same settings. I tried the Synergy module beside my standard offering and it's nearly identical when the switch is set to even the playing field.
2: Since all mods are custom built, you can always order one with extra sizzle, darker or whatever you like. I would venture to guess 30% of the 4500+ MTS mods I've done had such requests from their original owner.
3: I've always said it and have no researched explanation aside from the additional switching circuitry, but dual channel Egnater modules always sounded around 5-10% duller to me than a single channel of the same exact circuit. Take that for what it's worth.
All said, the team did a great job on these modules and you guys that are loyal to the technology should get out there and try it. If for nothing else to support the brand. For those interested on the East Coast, you can try out my personal Synergy gear at the shop anytime we are open. I'm also in discussions about carrying it in my storefront along with my own modules and the custom amps I build.
1: For a true apples-to-apples comparison, the Synergy SLO needs to have the cathode bias switch set to the Fender position. The 1K8/1uF default SLO Synergy setting provides a high frequency shelving boost that starts to roll off at 2K and is -3db down around 150hZ. The Randall default is 1K5/22uF, which is essentially full frequency and only starts to roll off around 100hZ. This is the perceived difference in brightness at the same settings. I tried the Synergy module beside my standard offering and it's nearly identical when the switch is set to even the playing field.
2: Since all mods are custom built, you can always order one with extra sizzle, darker or whatever you like. I would venture to guess 30% of the 4500+ MTS mods I've done had such requests from their original owner.
3: I've always said it and have no researched explanation aside from the additional switching circuitry, but dual channel Egnater modules always sounded around 5-10% duller to me than a single channel of the same exact circuit. Take that for what it's worth.
All said, the team did a great job on these modules and you guys that are loyal to the technology should get out there and try it. If for nothing else to support the brand. For those interested on the East Coast, you can try out my personal Synergy gear at the shop anytime we are open. I'm also in discussions about carrying it in my storefront along with my own modules and the custom amps I build.
withmittens
Well-known member
I wonder if it's possible for either modder to include this internal switch, or one that does essentially the same thing without copying it.
seems like it should have been there all along
seems like it should have been there all along
Capt_Tippy
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We should all crack a cold one and wait for Rob's list of 5 reasons why he can't hah (Don't get mad Rob :lol
Jaded Faith
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I'd need to take the module apart and see how the switch is doing it on the edge connector. Likely using one of the unused positions from the original design. Obviously the circuit is within the amp, so any switch added wouldn't do anything inside of a 1st Gen modular amp like a Randall or Egnater. It's also patented, so I think it's a slippery slope to do for profit (ie: offering as a service you could pay for) for a customer.
Keep in mind, this is a hurdle every stock or modded module ever made worked around in various ways. The old "swap out C3" mod documented here about 12 years ago was one of the many ways we overcame that handicap.
That said, I am a fan of good craft beers for whomever is buying the next round...
Keep in mind, this is a hurdle every stock or modded module ever made worked around in various ways. The old "swap out C3" mod documented here about 12 years ago was one of the many ways we overcame that handicap.
That said, I am a fan of good craft beers for whomever is buying the next round...
withmittens
Well-known member
it was my understanding the switch was inside each module switching between sets of resistors & capacitors for each of the 3 values.
you're saying it's in the amp? or the switch is in the preamp and the circuit is in the amp?
if so, the circuit could be on a small floating peg board and wired to the appropriate place. Could be do-able DIY is we knew the values and where the wires went.
you're saying it's in the amp? or the switch is in the preamp and the circuit is in the amp?
if so, the circuit could be on a small floating peg board and wired to the appropriate place. Could be do-able DIY is we knew the values and where the wires went.
Capt_Tippy
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Jaded Faith said:
I stand corrected. I think I only counted 4. I'm glad you can take it Rob.
I'd buy ya a beer but it's a long drive. If I ever make it up that way I'll be sure to stop by with a 6 pack.
Jaded Faith
Well-known member
I always say if you don't have thick skin and a good sense of humor this isn't the business for you. I'll gladly take an I.O.U. on that 6-pack!
Please don't quote me, but I think the circuit's in the amp. The switch is definitely on the modules. It is most logical that way to execute it, as the gain stage that's being switched is in the amp itself and having the circuitry (aside from the switch) on every module made would be illogically expensive on a mass-production scale.
Please don't quote me, but I think the circuit's in the amp. The switch is definitely on the modules. It is most logical that way to execute it, as the gain stage that's being switched is in the amp itself and having the circuitry (aside from the switch) on every module made would be illogically expensive on a mass-production scale.
